No spark

[Narvdude]

Hi all, this is my first post so i'll try to explain stuff as best as I can!

Bought a H reg ZXR 400 from a lad who had been using on track. He had taken out the ignition barrel, junction box, etc.. to make it into a race wiring system.
He removed the sidestand switch, and the bike starts from the just flicking the Kill Switch to Run then pressing the starter.
When I bought it, the battery was flat, as was the spare he gave me. So charged them both when I got home.
Tried both batteries and neither of them are creating a spark from the plugs (even stuck new plugs in to check that).
Emailed Baz to see what he thought, he said new battery would be a good shout as they need the right charge. So I got one and that aint doing it either!

Ive put a different Regulator/Rectifier, CDI unit in and they haven't made a difference.
When I got the bike home for the first time there were 2 wires, which had spade ends that were hanging loose. One is Black/Yellow, and the other is Green/Black.
I know that the Black/Yellow should be attached to the battery, as I checked the wiring diagram. But the Green/Black just goes to the CDI....it puzzles me what its for?

So I think that pretty much sums up my problems! Hopefully someone can tell me its just a case of im thick and missing something!

Thanks,
Narvik (parents are weird...I was named after the port in Norway. Im from Bolton)

[Mori Man]

Hi Narv,

Chasing electrical gremlins is no fun

The workshop manual on the front page of this site will give you the wiring diagrame for the H so just be methodical going through it and see what changes have been done turning it into a race loom.

Good luck & welcome BTW,

MM!

[mick41zxr]

From memory green/black is your sidestand cutout, black/yellow is earth. I think you will need to connect to two to fool the cdi to think that the sidestand is up when removed.
Regards,
MB

[Veemax]

I had a similar problem a few months ago- no visible spark at the spark plugs. I went round and round in circles for days. It seems that a lot of these bikes suffer from weak spark- a spark may not be visible if a spark plug is inserted into one of the leads and earthed out! I’ve found that the best way to check, is with a timing light, just to see if it flashes. If it flashes then you can assume that the ignition side is working ok, but voltage may be low. I solved the problem by simply fitting a new set of plugs gapped to 0.015” (about 0.4mm) smaller than normal. It seems to have done the trick and starts first time now!

It sounds simple- I know, but may be worth a try!

Ian

[Narvdude]

Ok cool will try that but, what is a Timing Light? And where can I find out how to space the plugs?
(Its all new to me so I apologise for being thick)

Narv

[Veemax]

Just do a search for “timing light”- they vary in price, I’d recommend the type that’s powered by the vehicle’s battery, it’s far brighter! You can gap the plugs with a "feeler gauge", be careful not to mix up inches and millimetres!

Ian

[Narvdude]

Ok so ive tried spacing the plugs, and that hasn't done it. Didnt get a timing light as they didnt have one down at the local garage. Is there any point now though?

Back to square one!

[Veemax]

Yes- I’d still check with a timing light of some sort! It’s a process of elimination, never assume anything, otherwise you’ll go round and round in circles. You need to see if you’ve got voltage at the spark plugs. Check all four leads with the timing light, you don’t even have to remove the plugs, it’s that easy. Here’s a basic one- EBay item number 170634863963.

Ian

[Veemax]

Have you sorted it out yet?

Ian

[Narvdude]

No not yet! Im just waiting to get money to buy a Timing Light then i'll try that.
Ive still been having a play here and there....do you think its worth seeing if the Pickup Coil is ok?? Im sure ive asked someone that before and they said dont bother, but it
hasn't run the entire time ive had it.

Narv

[Veemax]

As I’ve said- it’s a matter of elimination, one thing at a time, otherwise you may end up wrecking something that is perfectly ok. If you want to try something else in the meantime- make sure you have fresh fuel in the tank, best to drain it out and put a gallon or so of fresh fuel back in. Then drain the carburettor float bowls, drain about half a cupful from each one. The drains have allen headed bolts and you’ll need a long extension to reach them. Have a look at the manual- download it from this site. The reason why I say this, is that the fuel might be stale, especially if it’s not been started for a while. Try starting it again.

Have you seen the engine run at all, or did you buy it as a non-runner, or were you assured by the seller that it would run ok with a new battery?

Ian

[Narvdude]

The guy I bought it from was selling it because he didn't have the time anymore to use it as university was taking up all his time. He had been on track with it only, and the last time was a may I think (the sticker was on the bike from the trackday). When I turned up he had just got it out the shed and was pulling out 2 big boxes of spares as well. He tried to start it, but the battery was flat, and thats what I assumed as thats what batteries do!
I will dran the crabs as I bet it wont do it any harm!
As for the Timing Light, one is on its way!

Narv

[Veemax]

Ok- I understand things better now. It might be a good idea to check the date on the trackday sticker, if it’s more than a month or so- and it hasn’t been used since- then there’s a good chance the fuel is stale. Get some good fuel in the carburettors and a well charged battery, you may find that it’ll start ok. If not, you’re back to the troubleshooting!

On the subject of batteries- get an “intelligent” charger. I’ve unknowingly wrecked many batteries by overcharging them. The best charger I’ve ever had was from Lidl’s believe it or not, it looks a lot like the CTEK one, but costs a fraction of the price (£12.99). They repeat the same deal every few months- look out for one. http://thumbsnap.com/sc/OA6wEoqn.jpg

Ian

[RedexRobB]

If your not too shy at taking the things apart, get the rocker cover off and check the timing marks on the side of the cams (you'll need a mirror), and compare with the timing marks on the pickup; its free!

help here: viewtopic.php?f=55&t=8002 you dont need to do the whole process just some of its to check the timing, you could even use the manual on the main site.

Speaking of which it could be worth testing the pickup coil while your down there.

[Davw]

Narv

1) Is the starter turning when the button is pressed - I am assuming yes. If so have you tried starting with jump leads off a car battery - sometimes the zxr needs a little more juice to start after being laid up for a period. have you checked the plugs/ plug gap

2) Is the ignition pickup connector clean and mated

3) Is the CDI connectors clean and fully mated

3) have you tried a new plug in each of the HT leads - is there a spark in any of them

4) if no spark in any then it is a single point failure - either the CDI or the ignition pickup. It is possible (but very unlikely) that both coils have failed

5) If a spark in one or two if the HT leads then a coil has failed or is failing (or the wiring to the coil) - see test in the manual for the coil

Not sure what the strobe light is going to do for you as you dont have a spark at all. Timing is not the problem - lack of sparks is. If you can get sparks this will fire - unless as mentioned above the cams are off or the coils are connected to the wrong electrical cables.

Finally - are you sure you have an H CDI and not an L. They are not compatible iirc (check the colour of the sticker and the code on the CDI)