Bemsee introduce new 60bhp catagory for 2010

[Ballsout Racing]

For those interested:

Bemsee 2010 rules here: http://www.bemsee.net/info-centre/doc_d ... -regs-2010

60bhp section:

5a 60bhp CATEGORY
New for 2010 subject to a minimum of 8 entrants, a separate Championship for “stock”
engines. Entrants are required to declare they are competing in this series but may also
score in the Main and Rookie Championships.
To be eligible for this class, machines must not produce more than 60bhp, as measured at
the rear wheel on the BMCRC Dyna-Pro dynamometer, after racing.
The Club will adopt the policy that if the same machine and/or rider fails bhp testing three
times during the season then the rider will be excluded from the Sub-60 Championship.
Modifications allowed: Exhaust system, airbox and jetting may be changed.
All other engine components and ignition system must be as original manufacture.
All other technical specifications as per the main championship.

[Robbie]

That is similar to what was the proddie 400 class in Scotland apart from the bhp limit.Oh and they made us run shitty control tyres.Im all for standard engines saves people spending a fortune on tuning.As long as the organisers do check the power out puts.As there was a lot of cheating that went on in the proddie class up here but the KDMC club officials didnt want to hear about it :wanker

[Ballsout Racing]

Bemsee now own their own Dyno truck that was used in the past few years. Checks were very frequent in the past so I gues may be even more so next year. It's all looking good

[zimm]

does F3 kit ignition/loom/airbox/trumpets/cams count as stock ? i mean its all OE kawasaki ?

In all seriousness I'd be scared of competing on a fit stocker ... the graph is elsewhere on here but Em's ZX-4 made 62bhp on a dynapro dyno, yes its modded but only from ZX-4 to ZXR spec... doesnt even have a decent pipe on it, just OE copy headers with a race can.. its also VERY tired with millions of miles on it glazed bores and cock all compression till its warmed up...

i know all dyno's vary .. but this was a dynapro, and it was showing readings of anywhere between 45 and 60 for the honda 400's that turned up on the day, some of which were fairly sorted bits of kit, including an NC30 racebike owned by the dyno operator so im happy to think it wasnt just an optimistic dyno.

what happens if they dyno a bike, find its over 60bhp but completely standard ?

time to buy a gsxr/nc30/cbr ?

are 2 strokes allowed ? i quite fancy a 55bhp TZR 250 ... mmmmmmmmmmmm

[Ballsout Racing]

Zimm, I think that 62bhp was quite exceptional. Are you sure the bores were glazed? how do you know! either way if the tolernances were spot on when warmed up then that could explain it. I beleive race engines are built 'looser' anyway. I also believe that Dyna Pro also can use an 'inertia drum' I think it's called or something like that, I know that those setups give another 2 or so bhp on top of the 'ordinary circuit dyno.

The idea is for people to be able to have 'cheap' 400 racing, and not be put off by the relatively expensive super tuned 80bhp bikes. Yes, two strokes are allowed and IMHO a decent well ridden RS250 will be the machine to beat

[zimm]

Zimm, I think that 62bhp was quite exceptional. Are you sure the bores were glazed? how do you know! either way if the tolernances were spot on when warmed up then that could explain it.

i know the state of that engine well mate... its the first one i ever rebuilt, and ive been in there 3 times since to change head-gaskets, replace cam followers etc .. bores, pistons and valve seats are way way past their best but my ex is too cheap to spring for new parts, and its kinda turned into a challenge to see if it'll get to 100k miles on the stock pistons/bores. Incidentally, the fuelling was off at the time, its running better now after a jetting change.

I beleive race engines are built 'looser' anyway. I also believe that Dyna Pro also can use an 'inertia drum' I think it's called or something like that, I know that those setups give another 2 or so bhp on top of the 'ordinary circuit dyno.

it was a dyna pro s125lc load control dynamometer at projex in cradley heath

The idea is for people to be able to have 'cheap' 400 racing, and not be put off by the relatively expensive super tuned 80bhp bikes. Yes, two strokes are allowed and IMHO a decent well ridden RS250 will be the machine to beat

still got your old one ?

[Ballsout Racing]

OK, fair enough, it's still unusual for a stock engine beleive me, maybe you're a genius engine builder

I know little about Dyno's, just that they can all read different, and even depends on who operats it. Load Cell could have been what I'm talking about, all I know is that having spoken to the bemsee truck operator Mark, who makes the things, on numerous occasions and a friend who uses one in his workshop, they do give different readings due to this 'difference'.

Yep, still got my 250, but it was/is fully kitted. Now if I could find a standard engine In all seriousness, I doubt I'll be racing at all this year due to my shoulder injury

[Ballsout Racing]

OK, an update on what I know, as I hadn't been involved in any discussions on theis new 60bhp class but have now some better info. There's a thread on motoforum.net that goes into it a bit more, go here to have a look: http://www.motoforum.net/index.php?showtopic=40039

does F3 kit ignition/loom/airbox/trumpets/cams count as stock ? i mean its all OE kawasaki ?

No. You are allowed the airbox though. At the end of the day what's the point in spending money on all that if it's going to push it over 60bhp, it defeats the object of the class, ie very cheap (relatively) 400 racing. Having said that, if you've got an SP then you'll have the cams as standard. I have since been told that Mark, the manufacturer and dyno operator assures bemsee that he has never seen a 'srock' 400 over 60bhp, he was consulted to establish this limit. It's interesting to note that a 'stock' zxr has read 64bhp on a DynaPro Dyno, but that Dyno's can read whatever you want them to. Read into that whatever you will, but the bemsee Dyno is the one that will be doing all the testing.

what happens if they dyno a bike, find its over 60bhp but completely standard ?

As above, it won't be, if it is, it's been tuned. In the eventuality that if it's fractionaly over, then it would be easy to detune to be within the rules.

[zimm]

thanks for the clarification..

didnt mean to be antagonistic, I've just started building this years bikes and thinking about which clubs/classes etc ...


have most of an F3 kit and a selection of ignition boxes, cams, airboxes etc to pick from.. just a case of choosing a class and building accordingly.

[Ballsout Racing]

thanks for the clarification..

didnt mean to be antagonistic, .

I didn't take it like that at all. When you can't see or hear people talking, just reading, it's very difficult to judge the tone of the words, hence smilies but even they don't work sometimes.

Anyway, whatever you decide, good luck

BTW, have you seen the prize fund, announced yesterday? : EDIasia announces Sponsorship of 400's to Continue in 2010

[twistgrip]

Hi everyone

I am John Sanders - President of EDIasia Ltd the sponsors of the EDIasia BMCRC Formula 400 Championship, and owner of "asianmoto" a motorcycle sport website based as it says in asia !!

Having just joined this board I would like to thank Greville for "advertising" the Championship that I hope loads of you will join - whether the "Stock" or "Tuned" section - both will be fun, of that I am 100% sure.

The only unfortunate part from my perspective is that I will only be able to get over to watch 2 rounds again this year (business is not good enough to fund lots of trips and the prize fund!!) so I verymuch rely on hearing about the racing and racers across the copper wires and satelite links etc.

Anyway, enough about me, just to repeaat that I hope oodles of you will take part - more Kwacking Diesels the better is what I say !!

Now just to try and gain a bit of advantage I will GUARANTEE that at least one of the Random 200 Pound prizes during the season will go to a ZXR400 Forum member who is a "newbie" in our Championship.

Come on - who's joining ?

See ya at Pembrey or on the Net somewhere.

John

PS. It was a Google Alert (continual checking for EDIasia) that found this Board so don't forget that nothing on this Forum is for members only !!

[jake]

Hi John
I for one would like to say thanks to your massive support for the class. I dont even ride for bemsee, but its still great that people like you make the step from talking to putting something in place again and again.
I said it last year, i wish there was support like this for other smaller clubs to, but i can appreciate that John possibly makes a loss every year with his support and does it just for the love of it, not that its about money... but it still is hard times, so total credit to you.

[sinap]

Hi John
I am definately planning on doing the full season with bemsee for 2010 in the EDI 400 TUNED CLASS, I did a couple of meetings last year with bemsee, Oulton and Cadwell and was really impressed by the way the club ran the meetings, they seem to be able to get the races out with a minimum of waiting round in the holding area, also the level of competition is high throughout the field,this will be my second season in the 400 class and before we started loads of people advised us not to bother with the 400s as they are a dying breed but our limited experience is that the 400s quite often have full grids and provide a good mix of experienced and young riders learning the way like me, it also seems a more natural step to the 600 and 1000 classes.
Like Jake I would like to thank you for your continuing support of the 400s.

See you at Pembrey

Si
#91

ps I ate all my sprouts and they definatetly make you go faster ( and more often)

[quickkwak07]

hello has any body got an idea/figure of how much each race meet costs them not the petrol to get there or mechanical costs just the cost to get on the grid of that makes sense?